>The SAHD Truth
>You think being a stay-at-home mom is hard? Try being a stay-at-home dad.
We have our MOMS and our MOPS and our playgroups and our Mommy Mixers and hundreds of other outlets where we can share our joys and frustrations with putting our careers on hold in order to take care of the kids. But the dads? Well, they pretty much have… nothing.
Not only that, but they’re viewed with something akin to disdain by much of society. I mean, what kind of man would let his wife make the money, many people wonder, while he sits around watching soaps, changing diapers and eating bon bons? What’s wrong with him, anyway?
It’s SAHD, really.
Anyway, I explored the difficult and lonely plight of the stay-at-home dad in this week’s Nashville Scene edition of Suburban Turmoil and heard some crazazy stories about the guys in the process. Being a stay-at-home mom might not be that hard, but being a stay-at-home dads just might be one of the most difficult jobs out there.
Here’s the full text of the column:
The SAHD Truth
A man wearing a baby carrier strapped to his chest walks past a Green Hills construction site, where yet another McMansion is being erected on a postage-stamp lot. When he stops to look, he notices the construction workers gathering together aggressively and giving him the evil eye. One of the guys approaches him.
“Can I help you with something?”
“I’m just walking my baby,” the dad answers defensively.
The construction worker sees the infant and relaxes. “Oh,” he says. “We thought maybe you were carrying a machine gun in that thing.” Such is the life of a stay-at-home dad, a specimen so rare in Nashville that his Baby Bjorn just might be mistaken for an Uzi Coozie.
Stay-at-home dads are like the lepers of the childcare caste system. We know they’re out there and we love to talk about how they’re really no different from the rest of us, but when we see them changing a poopie diaper on a park bench or singing, “Itsy Bitsy Spider” at Mommy & Me, we stay the hell away. And before you feel guilty about that, don’t worry: apparently, they stay the hell away from each other, too. The baby wearer tells me he’s met hardly any other stay-at-home dads around town, and “the ones that exist don’t enjoy networking. For the most part, they just stay huddled in dark little corners, afraid to go out in public.”
That leaves their wives to do the networking for them.
“Aren’t you Lindsay Ferrier?” a woman asked me when I ran into her at the library not long ago. “I live in your neighborhood and heard you have a playgroup for three-year-olds.”
“I do,” I said. “Do you have a three-year-old?”
“Yes,” she said, “and my husband stays home with her. He’d love to join your playgroup; he gets so lonely being at home all day. Can I get your number?”
“Uh… Okay,” I said, scrawling something unintelligible on the scrap she handed me, and hoping she wouldn’t look too closely at it until after we’d parted ways. I’m sure the dude was nice, but we’d had a SAHD show up before at playgroup and it was about as much fun as Pedro Garcia’s going-away party. The moms, all of whom generally arrive with hilarious stories about their bumbling husbands, irritating in-laws, or pending divorces, all sat around with bright, false smiles, and exchanged nervous pleasantries for 45 minutes until the dad finally made up some excuse, grabbed his son and split. As soon as the front door slammed, we all burst out laughing. I tried to explain the situation recently to a dad friend of mine who now raises his six-month-old daughter while his wife brings home the bacon.
“I don’t get it. Stay-at-home moms have support groups and clubs and online networks,” he complained. “But there’s nothing out there for the dads. What am I supposed to do?”
“Well, you can’t come to my playgroup,” I said. He looked at me with big, sad eyes and my resolve weakened. “But I guess you could bring your daughter over for a playdate,” I offered. Quickly, he accepted.
Preparing for a playdate with a stay-at-home dad is a curious thing. I found myself actually drying my hair after I got out of the shower that morning and I even took the time to check my fingernails for dried poo. On the other hand, I spent far less time cleaning the house than I do when moms come over. If this SAHD was anything like my husband, I reasoned, he wouldn’t notice, anyway.
Once he arrived, we sat on the floor and let the kids play while we chatted. It wasn’t long before our conversation went from baby milestones to something much more personal.
“I gained ten pounds after Leigh was born,” he confided. “I’ve definitely been rocking the pear shape.” I clucked sympathetically. I’m an apple myself, but I could imagine how much it would suck to be a man with big hips. “No big deal, though,” he continued. “A few good, hard rides took it right back off.” I gasped before remembering that pre-baby, he was a hardcore cyclist.
“How else has having a baby changed you?” I asked him, recovering quickly.
“Well, it’s not just about me anymore,” he answered. “It’s not even about me and my wife. Now, it’s all about my daughter.”
“That’s beautiful,” I said with tears in my eyes. He looked at me expectantly. Oh shit. I’d opened the door.
Look, my playgroup’s full,” I said. “But I know of a place that’s perfect for you.” I told him about the Green Hills MOMS Club, an entire organization devoted to parents who stay at home with their kids. As far as I knew, they had never had a SAHD before, but there’s a first time for everything, right? “I think you and the MOMS Club were made for each other,” I assured him. He seemed excited.
It was the least I could do.
>My hubby started off as a SAHD and did really well but had no friends. When we switched roles I was empathetic to any SAHD I encountered and invited them into our group. Our group would always start off on politics, school issues, community issues and the guys would always love that part but we always spiraled into boob jobs, hubbies who forgot to take out the garbage and hormones and the guys would act like they enjoyed the conversation but you would soon find that they were too busy for playgroup,hmmm maybe they weren’t so busy after all….
>This is so true! My husband, a former pilot, bid farewell to the friendly skies to stay home with our daughter. He is an AMAZING SAHD but has no outlet for adult interaction and certainly doesn’t want me networking for him. When we met one of our neighbors, she said, “Are you home with your daughter? Because if you are we have a wonderful neighborhood play group/moms group and we’d love for you two to join.” When I emphatically told her that my husband was a SAHD and he’d love to join she looked at me disparagingly and said, “oh well it’s only for moms – some of them breastfeed and wouldn’t feel comfortable with a man there.” Curious that my husband was the one who insisted that our daughter be breastfed and all out convinced me to do it. Still it probably would make him uncomfortable as well.It’s a hard situation for sure. Thank you for taking the time to give a voice to the SAHD’s and the families that love them!
>I think you were mean for not letting an SAHD into your playgroup (and no, this isn’t going to be a scathing attack, I’m just telling you how I feel)My DH is a SAHD and is amazing. Our son has flourished and I’m so proud of the decision we’ve made. Financially, it has been very hard, but we’re making it work for now. He is pretty much a loner. He tries to talk to other moms, but gets the cold shoulder frequently. Fortunately, he’s very self-confident so he just brushes it off. He’s also one of the kindest, most genuine, funny people you’ve ever met (seriously, people LOVE him!!!) so the moms that have blown him off have done themselves a disservice.He now has a few mom friends, because they stepped out of their box to talk to him, and you know what? I’ve made new friends that way too. These women are great and are very supportive.Just because they are men, they work just as hard as the women, only they have no support. Next time, give the guy a chance. You don’t just have to talk about boob jobs and husbands 🙂
>FireDad doesn’t “stay at home” everyday. He’s a professional firefighter. So he works 24 hours on and has 48 hours off. So, sometimes, he takes the boy(s) to library or wherever. And he gets interesting looks, stares and comments. That said, he’s a terribly laid back kind of guy and doesn’t really mind. But I mind for him! I get all riled up! 😉
>Ick. You made fun of the Green Hills Mom playgroup for being all snooty and what not, but yours sounds the same. What are you, a sorority girl, or some crap? I have to part ways with you on this one. I’m not a SAHD or even a SAHM but I don’t think I would want to join such a cliquey, girly group who can’t socialize with “egads! boys!!!” or who are so addicted to their “vagina and boobie talk”. Yick.
>Oh God, people, please remember this is a HUMOR column.
>My husband is now the full-time parent while I work from home freelancing. I was at home with the kids full time for ten years and when Brett got laid off in March, we decided I’d take the plunge and work full-time from my basement office while he took care of house/kids/etc. It’s been easier for him in some ways because our social support systems were already set up. The friends I’ve had for years already know and care about our family and the playdates were already in place. But it’s been a big adjustment for him in spite of this. (What helps is that he’s a loner, too, and also I can come up from the basement and take over sometimes to give him a break.)
>Not laughing…. just a little disappointed I think.
>My husband was a fulltime SAHD for three years while my youngest was an infant/toddler; he now works 15 hrs/wk in order to be home when my girls are home from school. The interesting thing is that this isn’t such a big deal where we are from – hopefully this is a sign of times to come. There have been three other SAHDs in the same neighborhood, plus at least 3 other real estate types who were regularly at home as well. I think this is attributable to being in a progressive, university town. One mom, whose girls were my girls’ age, was at first uncomfortable at the prospect of just knocking on the door when he was home because it was unusual to her. Now she never thinks twice about it.Our neighborhood – which is luckily full of kids and is very friendly and open – doesn’t have formal play groups. It’s much less informal – whoever is outside gets to play and socialize with everyone else who is outside without any one being in or out of the play group. Frequently my husband will be playing football and baseball with the older boys in the neighborhood, while our daughters are playing with the younger kids. I think it’s awesome that all these boys (and girls) see him (and the others in the neighborhood) in this role. To them it will not be a big deal when they grow up. They have grown up with the idea that families work with the opportunities they have and develop the solutions that fit their lives.
>I guess I’ll have to work on my punchlines…
>My husband is a part time SAHD. He works nights and weekends while I work days and let me tell you, he kicks ass when it comes to doing things with our soon to be four year old twins, and daughters ages 7 and 9.They go to the park, library, CEC, playlands etc. When it comes to play groups though, he wouldn’t touch one with a ten foot pole. He’s just not a guy to hang around with people he has nothing in common with just so the kids can play. So, he makes it much more fun for the kids going out as a family, and I host the playdates on the weekends. I do have a friend who is a very active father and very comfortable when it comes to playgroups/dates and such. Unfortunately, he makes me and the other moms uncomfortable because he does the chick talk, but he is very sexual and very pushy, as he hits on the moms and such.
>My brother in law was a SAHD for his son’s first year. I invited him to playgroup a couple of times, but it was a little awkward. He didn’t come after a couple of tries, and I must admit that I wasn’t too sorry, although I felt bad for feeling this way. I think that there is a certain comfort level that women have when they are together that is different than when they are in mixed company. It is just a different way to relate, and you don’t have to be talking about “girl” stuff for this to be true. Similarly, I don’t think I would invite a guy to a girl’s night out. I think it would also be different if there were a couple of SAHDs in the group, but I don’t know because I ‘ve never tried it.
>Sometimes, I don’t know what it is about people, humor and honesty. I get it, it is ok to be relieved that the playgroup wouldn’t work with a man, not mean (humor understood). I also commented (back on your original post) that I felt that being a SAHM was one of the most difficult things I ever did, but I understand other points of view.I don’t feel disappointed, or that you are mean. I do think you continue to be honest, which is why I come back.My girls are 7&8 now, and my husband works part time, to get home in time to meet them at the bus stop each day and shuttle them to activities, and start homework and dinner. It is a sacrifice for our family, similar to the one we made when I stayed home when they were babies. He does not feel comfortable letting them have play dates unless I am home. He did one over the summer with a girl that had her school teacher dad staying home with her, and he said it was weird and didn’t repeat it, even though the other dad sort of stalked him for a while (guess he was lookin’ for a buddy).Barbara
>Sometimes I don’t know what it is about people. Especially people who are ninnies.Bah. Let’s all get together and tell each other how much we appreciate each other, and what winners we all are, and how we are all special and fantastic. Then I think we should go and freeze our bras, do a few trust leans (I trust my team. Let me fall into your arms.) and have a discussion about tampons and bad boyfriends. Then we can have a discussion about how we all agree about how right we are about everything on the planet.Yuck. If you put your opinion out into the ether that is the internet and allow people to comment on it, then expect some people to disagree. Perhaps some people will disagree a lot. Perhaps some people might not see your humor. I know it is hard to believe, but it is true. All 4 billion people in the world don’t have the same sense of humor.I am having a really bad day so on the “sense of humor scale”, I am registering pretty damn low.I am also at work. Where is my child? At home with my husband, who is neither lewd nor crude, but a hardworking parent, a loyal husband and a great person. It sucks that my little boy will be excluded from interacting with other children because women gang up together and exclude them. It reminds me of Dumbo when all the adult elephants put their big asses together and leave Dumbo out.Women demand to be included everywhere in the world, from work to clubs, to sports. So why is it that we can’t open our ranks and let another parent/child in? Men have had to change the way they deal with the opposite sex. Maybe women could try to do the same.
>LOL…Lindsay, you tapped a vein here without even trying ;-)I worked with someone who became a SAHD since when he worked with me, he made half what his wife made, and with two kids, they figgered it’d be better on a number of fronts to opt for home care vs daycare. Last time I ran into him, he was bigger than a triple-wide file cabinet(he was only a double-wide when I worked with him), and spends his days with the kids, on the computer, eating bonbons (or anything else within reach) and doesn’t care a whit about letting his wife be the breadwinner. I think I can summarize his opinion by saying “SAHD ain’t BAHD”.
>Very true! A friend of ours stayed home for a year and said he always felt like there weren’t any social outlets for him as a SAHD.
>Gertie, I guess I’m flummoxed because before the SAHD in my column left, he said, “Let’s get together with the kids at least every other week!” He wasn’t offended about not being invited to join my playgroup (I told him the whole story about the one time we had a dad over), so I feel bad that you are offended over some perceived slight. Honestly, if his feelings had been hurt, I wouldn’t have written the column that way. I have to live here, you know! ;)We haven’t even touched on the other issue here, which is that many wives wouldn’t feel comfortable if their stay-at-home husbands were having regular playdates with other women. That’s another thing that can make it a little weird. It’s just not a SAHD world, unfortunately, and I wish that it were.I do think that as time goes by, more and more women will be working while their husbands stay home and SAHDs will start mobilizing in real life and not just online.
>I can understand how some people might get upset over this post, especially if they have husbands who are trying to connect with people. It really must be one of the most emotionally tough jobs in the world to be a SAHD. That said, I can’t say that I would be any different than you, Lindsay. In fact, I might be worse. I probably would try to invite some dads along to a group outing, or a casual get together. I think my group of moms could manage to lay off the girly talk at least once a month or so. However, I absolutely would not be comfortable having a one on one play date. I am incredibly old fashioned, and in my view, it would be so uncomfortable to have a one on one play date with a man. But, like I said, I am like a conservative 90 year old when it comes to these things.
>I have a couple of colleagues whose husbands are relegated to “stay at home dad.” In our society, there is indeed a stigma about a man not providing for his family. People always ask that question. “What’s wrong with him? Why isn’t he working?” we all secretly wonder.
>I have a couple of colleagues whose husbands are relegated to “stay at home dad.” In our society, there is indeed a stigma about a man not providing for his family. People always ask that question. “What’s wrong with him? Why isn’t he working?” we all secretly wonder.
>One thing that I have noticed is that people have lower expectations for SAHD. They are much more willing to offer to help than they are SAHM. I think that mitigates a lot of what makes it harder for dads. Standards (and judgements) are a lot higher and harder for Moms.
>Laughing at your drop-in comments, Lindsay! There’s a SAHD who goes to story time at our library. I always try to chat it up with him because our kids go to the same preschool, but he doesn’t say much back — just a quiet fellow. Yeah, they have to put up with all of us chatty Cathys if they want to “fit in!”
>Very interesting read. My hubby works from home, so he is kindof the stay at home dad. He definitely doesn’t get out much.
>my own sahd of the house quit sahd-dom. Not cut out for it. But he’ll always be so grateful for having spent the better part of the first two years of Thalia’s life with her.It’s a rare and amazing dad that has it in him. Come to think of it, it’s an amazing mom too.
>I volunteer for a nation wide service for pre-schoolers, which involves running the parents groups. We found that men did not enjoy playgroups, and discussed this at a conference.Studies find that men are not interested in sitting around talking like women, but they are interested in doing something. The way to a SAHDs heart was to ask him to fix the swing set. BUT, catch 22, was that men felt their time was more valuable and were not inclined to give up their services for free. The conference never really came up with a good option for SAHDs to be included, although I am at the moment trying to organise a SAMDs group for the Indian community within my area, that get together to watch cricket (a generous dad is offering his cable television equipped home for the cause). Also a SAHD pram jogging group on the cards. That’s my best idea so far. Any others?Helen in NZ
>I became good friends with a SAHD years ago. We had so much in common, really enjoyed each others company, and the kids enjoyed each other as well. We coached a softball team together. But, there was always a barrier to our relationship–it just feels weird to spend that much time with a man who is not your husband. Other SAHMs are definitely wondering if there’s something more going on. My husband was totally fine with our friendship, but I always wondered what his wife thought. In the end, even though there was only a platonic friendship between us, it was easier to just drift apart. It’s easy to say “who cares what society thinks,” but actually not caring is a little more difficult.
>Okay- I feel like I have to put my thoughts into it. I was a member of said playgroup. I was at the playgroup when sahd showed up. Picture this: group of 4 or 5 women who have known each other for 2+ years. We are in familiar territory. In walks someone that none of us really know and none of us really know how to react. It was pretty weird. No man had ever breached our group. Maybe if it had been established 2 years ago, that dads were welcome and some actually showed up, it wouldn’t have been weird. But, it was. I think that SAHDs are amazing. I have known several that absolutely love it and do a great job. I do think that there should be more outlets for them, but I’m glad Lindsay told that one that our playgroup was full. It would change the whole dynamics of the established group. And kids get weird when other dads are around. They don’t let us gossip or drink our coffee in peace.
>My husband is a SAHD and I DO understand how a group of women can feel their conversation is disrupted when a man shows up in an established play date. But I really find some of these posts sad.Kids get weird when other dads are around? Sounds like the kids need some more exposure to dads…And is everyone really wondering what is wrong with my husband that he is home with my kids? Unbelievable!!!Or trying to put it off on the working mom that she wouldn’t be comfortable with their SAHD hanging out with SAHMs. Please….I sure hope the children of all these SAHDs don’t realize they are left out of the play dates and fund outings because some of you can’t handle talking to a man. I really feel sorry for those who can’t even hold a conversation, hang out at the park, or have a coffee with the dads one-on-one while their kids play. Is it really that hard?This may be why I would have never made it as a SAHM and I’m so thankful that my husband is such an awesome SAHD!!!
>My father was a SAHD for a year or two when I was a preschooler. This was back in the early 1980’s in a small town when there were *no* playgroups to join. But he took me for bike rides and read lots of books to me. He still smiles when he talks about the time we spent together. I think that, to this day, we are closer because of it.There was also a SAHD in the infant’s playgroup I went to when my son was little. The dad was pretty quiet the first few times he came, but we soon realized that he was a parent just like we were. Our group wasn’t too prone to sex talk, but what little there was fell away with the one man around. But I really don’t think anyone minded. If he was brave enough to join us, then we would welcome him. And there were nursing mothers in the group who did, in fact, manage to nurse their babies in front of a man who was not their husband and live to tell about it :)Really, having a SAHD in our playgroup was not a big deal at all.
>cvillemel, I think it’s interesting that while the argument in “When Harry Met Sally” (over whether women and men can be friends without there being any sexual tension between them) is a popular and hotly contested one, you seem to believe that parents are sexless beings who have forgotten what sexual tension is. It’s not so farfetched to think that this might be an issue for SAHDs trying to infiltrate the SAHM world. Does it preclude all attempts at friendship? No. But I’m willing to bet that it factors into some SAHDs’ unwillingness to get out there and mingle with the SAHMs, whether it’s because they feel uncomfortable or because they believe their wives would.
>I don’t disagree about sexual tension when going out for drinks after work with the office or if a SAHD did join a girls night out.But during a play date? To me, that’s like saying I should avoid lunch meetings or going on a business trip alone with a male co-worker.
>Flip this for a minute. What if roles were reversed and a SAHM were excluded in this manner? Immediate wall-to-wall CNN coverage, Oprah book deal, and branding as insensitive cretins would follow. The public outcry would be loud and immediate. A group of SAHDs could never get away the catty, “Mean Girls” type of exclusion and superiority you’ve demonstrated.But you chalk it up as acceptable to do this to SAHDs. You welcome them with “nervous smiles” and “pleasantries” to your playgroup, but then laugh behind their backs when they’ve left. And then you have the nerve and audacity to wonder why they never return. You make excuses about the perceived sexual tension that would exist were a dad to enter your inner sanctum, but you offer no proof that any such possible transgression. You use the excuse of breast feeding during the group as a means of exclusion, but you have no problem “popping them out and popping the kid on” in the middle of the food court at Opry Mills. You vainly and poorly attempt a humorous essay about the plight of SAHDs in and around Nashville (I’m just down the road in Huntsville by the way), but you accomplish nothing more than furthering the unacceptable attitude that predicated towards SAHDs every single day.
>cvillemel- Oh, I see the connection. Because sexual tension/adultery has never happened during any “business lunch” or on any business trip in the history of our great nation. My bad. Anyway, for a different perspective, rent “Little Children.” HH5? My heart bleeds for you. Truly. You are misunderstood, overlooked, marginalized, and justifiably hysterical about it.
>I didn’t say it never happened, but it is certainly not the rule.To say that a father can’t be alone with someone else’s wife while they are watching their kids play on the monkey bars because of sexual tension is just like saying that I should not go to a lunch appointment or on a business trip because a man and a woman can’t possibly maintain a professional relationship.My husband hangs out at our neighborhood pool all summer with SAHMs in bikinis with bodies sculpted from running marathons and going to the gym. Should I be threatened by that? I’m not. And he isn’t assuming that I’m falling into bed with the male colleagues.
>But cvillemel, the mistake you seem to be making in reading all this is that I’m not talking about you in particular. I’m talking about people in general. I had a playdate alone with a SAHD. I probably will again. But I can see how that would make some men and women, and more than just one or two out there, uncomfortable, not to mention their spouses. It’s the same whether you’re a SAHM or a SAHD or a businessman or a businesswoman. If a person is spending a lot of alone time with someone of the opposite sex, it tends to make their spouses uncomfortable. It also tends to make people talk.And this goes for you, too, hh5. A woman in a male-dominated field gets a lot of flack. That doesn’t make it right, but it happens and she goes into the field knowing that. The same holds true for a man in a woman-dominated field. That’s all I’m saying- and making light of. Maybe, hh5, just maybe, you’re learning what women have been up against in the working world for decades.
>Whoa, whoa, whoa! Back up the truck. So you attempt to justify your ignorance and intolerance towards SAHDs by throwing the “women have to put up with this kind of crap in the workplace” argument out? You admit it’s wrong there, but somehow it justifies your actions? You’re not helping matters one bit by just continuing the “status-quo” and using that as your justification for doing so. This is no different than excluding membership to an organization on the basis of race, creed, or sexual orientation. It’s wrong no matter what, and this elitist attitude only help perpetuate the stereotype that SAHMs are little more than hens clucking away in the hen house gossiping and spreading rumors about everyone and everything.Parenting isn’t a field to be dominated by one sex or the other. Parenting is supposed to be a joint effort, with each individual bringing their own unique abilities to the effort. Your article, and subsequent responses to it here, do nothing more than to highlight the fact that you don’t have the first clue what it’s like to be a SAHD and as such, you shouldn’t begin to try to explain it. And for the record, don’t lecture me on the hardships that women face in the workplace. My wife is a mechanical engineer for the oldest helicopter manufacturer in the world. She is one of three women in her office, and the only one that’s an engineer. She has busted her ass to get where she is, and she doesn’t take any crap from anyone about her gender. To add to it, she’s working on her master’s in Rotorcraft Design, which is even more exclusive of women. The only time she has it rough, is from other hens who continue to cluck away. You want to really know what it’s like for for a woman in a “male dominated world”? Read:http://gamingwithbaby.blogspot.com/2007/11/flip-side.html
>I didn’t explain it. I commented on it. Lighten up, dude. No need to get your panties in a wad. 🙂
>This whole argument just reinforces for me, that men and women need to take FAR more equal roles in parenting. The fact that either gender can claim any sort of exclusivity regarding child care is just… sad and absurd. Maybe your article will get some SAHD’s together to start their own clubs. You could have mixers! Hee.
>I think your article is funny. When my husband takes our son to school and stays for the morning meeting, he tries to make conversation with the few other dads there. They’ll barely acknowledge him! He’s not a SAHD, which makes it even more weird. We have at least one SAHD in our neighborhood (we had another one that I know of, but he went back to work). He’s a really cool guy (and is a lawyer taking some time off) and I’d totally hang out with him in the summer when we can be outside. But I would feel weird having just him and his kids over to my house when my husband wasn’t home. That said, if I were starting a neighborhood playgroup, I’d invite him. I do think there’s a different dynamic when you mix men and women. It’s not bad, but it is different. And in an established women’s group, it probably wouldn’t work, unless the man had a really exceptional personality. I do think it’s too bad that the kids get left out. Hopefully as more men stay home, they will begin to network in their own way, like by building treehouses and rc cars together (or whatever would appeal to a mens’ group!). I think some kind of men’s co-op where they help each other finish household projects and fix cars and do landscaping together while teaching skills to the kids would be an amazing thing! I’d be really jealous of such a group, personally. And I would wish that my hubby could be a SAHD so he could be in it. 🙂 I don’t think men don’t need womens’ groups. I think they need to figure out what works for them and allows them to be men (and masculine) while both meeting their very real needs for adult conversation and productivity and providing social interactions for their children. Good luck to all the SAHDs.
>i’m taking it to the next level honey.http://thestory.org/archive/the_story_273_Stay_At_Home_Dad.mp3/viewhttp://www.diyfather.com/content/podcast-interview-with-greg-barberaunfortunately, whether you choose to believe it or not, my experience has been that most women haven’t been to inviting to this SAHD. birthday invites still go to my wife’s account seven years in.teachers still give notes to my kids and tell them to give them to “mom.”fortunately, i have a sense of humor and an awesome wife.besides, when i go to playgroups i feel like all the women are eye fucking me.carry on ladies, but next time your minivan has a flat tire with your two kids and dog and a guy drives buy, consider that karma for snipin’ on the dad at the playgroup 😉
>Now that’s what I’m talking about.
>I’m a stay at home dad, but I don’t consider myself to be one of “the lepers of the child care caste system” as you say.That’s a pretty low blow, even if you are trying to get a cheap laugh.At least I see you might be, somewhere in there, trying to feel sorry for men that stay at home with their children, but actually putting your little story out there in the “Nashville Scene” as it’s written, does nothing but fuel the fire for the very idea you are pushing.Stick to your playgroup ranking Wiggles. There are plenty of outlets available for us lepers if we seek them out.
>Here’s another MAHD (Mostly At-Home Dad) with a vote to keep this crap confined to an unread blog or a tea party chat. Humor’s a fine goal, but you’re generalizing about SAHDs and parents and doing them all about as much service as a bad sitcom.Fortunately, there are Moms that are welcoming to SAHDs and even great playgroups featuring both Dads and nursing mothers. Granted, those situations may be slightly less *humorous* than ones where you can play on (and reinforce) the ‘awkward, bumbling Dad’ stereotype.But then again, you may find some very funny Dads (as I have, thankfully).
>As a regular reader of both your column and your blog, I just want to say don’t let these couple of whining, wussy dads get you down.I know several dads at my work who read your latest column and laughed their asses off. Some of them have even stayed at home with their kids before while their wives worked and they said everything you wrote was true.Don’t worry, Lindsay. Some of us still have a sense of humor. These guys need to get over themselves and stop having shit fits about a humor column.-Manda
>Lindsay-Just wanted to say I’m sorry for leaving hysterical, snippy comments on your blog. My husband being a SAHD wasn’t exactly the way it was supposed to happen. I was supposed to stay home. Unfortunately, as life often has a way of doing, it didn’t work out exactly like we thought. I worry everyday (and especially the day of your post) that I’m not there. That I’m not the one putting him down for naps, or playing blocks, or keeping him from eating toilet paper. I can get wracked with anger, and fear and guilt. Your post just made me think “Great. Now my son will be left out in the cold, shunned by playgroups.” because ONCE AGAIN I’m not there. Anyhow, your Perfect Post nominee said you should treat her blog like you would her house. I certainly wouldn’t come into your house spouting off like that. Well, maybe. If I was really drunk or something…. So anyhow, I’m sorry.
>Thanks, Gertie. No harm done. :)Just because I write about things doesn’t mean I think they’re the way it ought to be. I don’t. If anything, I’m glad this column provoked some discussion about SAHDs. Some people read it and probably thought about resources and social outlets for SAHDs for the very first time. I know I did when I talked to the SAHD I ended up writing about.
>You see Lindsay, you shouldn’t meddle in the affairs of SAHDs. Your failed attempt at humor has only further damaged those of us whose only crime is having testicles while stay home caring for our kids.So the next time I’m up in Nashville, and I see a mini-van with the prerequisite flat and soccer mom on her cell phone, playing the part of helpless/hopeless woman, with infant, three year old, and teenage step-kids in tow, I won’t blow by with finger in the air. Rather I’m going to slow down, open the bomb bay doors, and let the moon hang.
>Hey there, Lindsay.Just wanted to put my two cents in.I work with touring music acts and came home from the last go-round to see my beautiful baby boy being born. Since then, I’ve been a SAHD. It’s been a little difficult to adjust, really. I liked your article because it hinted at what I’m dealing with lately.At every gathering that includes my wife’s family, I’m bombarded with questions about my freelance work. (Have you been working lately? When’s your next gig? etc.) I feel as if my newly found SAHD-hood has cancelled out any respect I might have gained from being a member of working society. No one ever asks about the house I keep or more importantly, what it’s like to raise a son while your wife brings home the bacon. It’s an awkward subject for them when I could really use a little conversation on the matter.As for SAH-Mom playgroups, I can’t imagine ever fitting into one. The rarity of being a SAHD calls too much attention to the situation or adversely, draws away from the sense of normalcy that I would desire in such a group.
>I find both extremes funny here. I understand the humor, but I also agree that these days, we do all have to work together. My husband is a PT SAHD, and I have no issue with him having playdates with other women, or anything like that. I guess where we live, women have been working for a while, and it is not an issue. I trust him. I have had playdates with other Dads, and he does not have any problem with it. Get real!When everyone has a slightly different work/life situation, (whcih is the case where we are, and I assume it would be elsewhere) you have to be accommodating. There are times that I am going on a playdate with the kids, only to learn that their mom, who is my friend (and I am looking forward to seeing), is working that day, and I have to hang out with the nanny, or maybe the Dad. The point is, I don’t always want to, but that’s life, and sometimes it’s a bore, but sometimes I make a new friend as a result.Also, in Cambridge, where we live, there are two groups: a Mom’s, and a Dad’s, run by the city! (as well as many informal small ones). We also all have planned social events together. It provides a great outlet for both groups. Many guys who have joined the dad’s groups say they never would have thought they would do this, but they go, and have a great time.
>I find both extremes funny here. I understand the humor, but I also agree that these days, we do all have to work together. My husband is a PT SAHD, and I have no issue with him having playdates with other women, or anything like that. I guess where we live, women have been working for a while, and it is not an issue. I trust him. I have had playdates with other Dads, and he does not have any problem with it. Get real!When everyone has a slightly different work/life situation, (whcih is the case where we are, and I assume it would be elsewhere) you have to be accommodating. There are times that I am going on a playdate with the kids, only to learn that their mom, who is my friend (and I am looking forward to seeing), is working that day, and I have to hang out with the nanny, or maybe the Dad. The point is, I don’t always want to, but that’s life, and sometimes it’s a bore, but sometimes I make a new friend as a result.Also, in Cambridge, where we live, there are two groups: a Mom’s, and a Dad’s, run by the city! (as well as many informal small ones). We also all have planned social events together. It provides a great outlet for both groups. Many guys who have joined the dad’s groups say they never would have thought they would do this, but they go, and have a great time.
>I find both extremes funny here. I understand the humor, but I also agree that these days, we do all have to work together. My husband is a PT SAHD, and I have no issue with him having playdates with other women, or anything like that. I guess where we live, women have been working for a while, and it is not an issue. I trust him. I have had playdates with other Dads, and he does not have any problem with it. Get real!When everyone has a slightly different work/life situation, (whcih is the case where we are, and I assume it would be elsewhere) you have to be accommodating. There are times that I am going on a playdate with the kids, only to learn that their mom, who is my friend (and I am looking forward to seeing), is working that day, and I have to hang out with the nanny, or maybe the Dad. The point is, I don’t always want to, but that’s life, and sometimes it’s a bore, but sometimes I make a new friend as a result.Also, in Cambridge, where we live, there are two groups: a Mom’s, and a Dad’s, run by the city! (as well as many informal small ones). We also all have planned social events together. It provides a great outlet for both groups. Many guys who have joined the dad’s groups say they never would have thought they would do this, but they go, and have a great time.
>Little feedback, the jokes aren’t funny, but whatever gets you off. [shrugs]
>I’m a SAHD with a strong SAHM support system in place; I’ve overcome my own akwardness in these situations, and apparently the moms are fully capable of doing so as well, because the moms and I talk freely about every topic. I don’t know what the conversation would be like without me, my wife was in this group before I joined and we’ve compared notes; there doesn’t seem to be any difference.I actually thought your story was funny. I read it as a commentary on the work that still needs to be done among the SAHMs you know in Nashville.Then I read the comments, and your attempt to defend your attitude toward this parent.I agree that the situation was funny; but apparently I’m seeing the humor from the wrong side, because I don’t also see your behavior as defensible. Understandable doesn’t mean acceptable. We understand criminal behavior too; but that doesn’t mean we accept it.So, as with the drunks, the first step is admitting you have a problem. Say it with me now: “I am a SAHM who still has a stick up her ass. I would like to be better, or perhaps have a smaller stick.” Repeatedly saying that “it’s just humor” doesn’t actually mean what you think it means. What it means is that YOU think it’s funny and inoffensive and acceptable, not that everyone else OUGHT to agree. So when someone in your comments section calls you on your inappropriate behavior, don’t deflect. Just take your medicine.Now just take it one day at a time. I’ll be back to measure that stick later.
>”You can’t join our playgroup because you’re a guy” sounds a lot like “you can’t have this job because you’re a woman.” Is it just me? I’ve been a home dad for almost 5 years now.
>One of my brothers in law is a stay-at-home dad, like me, and he sexed up a mommy met on one of these playdates. Nearly destroyed two marriages.I get tired of moms who don’t socialize with me, especially when they’re socializing actively with other moms. But I gotta admit, I can understand why some of them are weirded out by the thought of becoming pals with a dad.
>Actually, it’s a group of gal pals, not a public organization or means of employment, so it sounds more like, “I’m not going to invite you to guy’s night out with my buddies who’ve gotten together weekly for the last three years because you’d totally change the dynamic.”I will absolutely have any one of you over to do makeovers, though, if you really feel left out. Oh and your kid can come, too.
>I love a good laugh and I love pushing the envelope as much as possible. However, as a SAHD, this struck a sore nerve. Whether the decision to become a SAHD was deliberate or the result of a change in our situation, SAHD’s are indeed social pariahs. We feel uncomfortable around SAHMs, who are the accepted norm. We feel uncomfortable when someone asks us that dreaded question, ‘So, what do you do?’ and when we answer, we have to deal with the raised eyebrows and hesitation that come a split second before we hear ‘That’s wonderful, it’s so hard to take care of kids’… right, we already saw what you really think flit across your face, ‘men should be working, not playing mom!’True, not everyone thinks like that, but the numbers of people who actually accept the idea of a SAHD is small and as such we face an uphill climb to become accepted. Even a seemingly harmless column like this damages our already fragile reputation. We’re already looked upon as a joke to most of society by simple *being* a SAHD and by writing this piece, you’ve only helped to perpetuate and strengthen that viewpoint.Also, I can’t help but wonder what the reaction would have been if the focus of the column were reversed and a SAHD poked fun at SAHM’s… we’re told by some of you, in a nutshell, ‘just shut up and take it, it’s only humor’. Would you have been silent and accepting? I doubt it. You may call it humor but I call it thinly veiled scorn and prejudice.
>You should at least admit that in your article, you made it sound like it was the SAHD’s awkwardness and sex that made you uninvite him from your playgroup — not the fact that a new individual can destroy the chemistry of an established, tightly-bonded group. The implication from your text is that SAHDs are just ill-suited to intermingle with SAHMs, which is so annoyingly ‘last-century’.
>Oh no. I would have invited a woman if she had wanted to join. It had everything to do with his sex.Face it. Women and men are different. I don’t want to go to a men’s poker night and talk about Pamela Anderson’s tits and I don’t want a man to come to my moms’ playgroup and hear me talk about boobs after breastfeeding, or whatever.That doesn’t mean I won’t hang out with him again, or go to a group for men and women. I totally would. But my particular playgroup is a girl thing. Deal with it.
>OK, so at least you’d admit that your women’s playgroup is on par with a men’s poker game / tit discussion. Personally, I wouldn’t want my child to attend either one, and I’m hoping they both die out as cliche’s of yesteryear. I’ll do my part by not hosting or attending said poker games….
>Okay, then I won’t go to any that you don’t host. It’s a deal.I would call my playgroup a-get-together-with-women-friends-who- happen-to-have-small-children, but it takes to long to say. Have those really died out? Perhaps for some of the diehard Internet crowd they have, but that makes me kind of sad.
>You forgot the -that-cant-handle-the-presence-of-a-Dad-whatsoever part, which is the reason you mentioned it in the article, right?
>I have been a SAHD for 29 months (29 and 8 month old girls here with me). I would think any dad comfortable and savvy enough to care for little ones on his own could handle a social setting of other parents (even if they are all female). I’m not complaining about how you kicked the SAHD out, but it isn’t very mature.
>First, I want to apologize for sending three identical posts to your site last time. How embarrassing. Hopefully, no one noticed. All I can say is that I have a slow internet connection at work, but I’ll take care not to do it again.I have to say I agree with the last post, which is sort of what I was saying earlier: we all have to work together on this. I can see if a private group of women friends don’t want to invite men (or vise-versa) but he was there that day, so why make fun of him? You were trying to make fun of the situation in your post; that is understandable, but it must have been really uncomfortable being him at that moment. I think if a guy crashed our mom’s group, I hope we would welcome him for the day, no problem.
>I’m sorry, where did I say we were rude to him? Everybody was totally nice, but it was uncomfortable. It just was. I could be like everyone else and pretend that I was perfect, and perfectly comfortable in every social situation but I just don’t do that here.
>”I’m sorry, where did I say we were rude to him? Everybody was totally nice, but it was uncomfortable.”How about right here:”The moms, all of whom generally arrive with hilarious stories about their bumbling husbands, irritating in-laws or pending divorces, all sat around with bright, false smiles and exchanged nervous pleasantries for 45 minutes until the dad finally made up some excuse, grabbed his son and split. As soon as the front door slammed, we all burst out laughing.”You were rude, crass, and thoughtless. Well over half the comments decry you for what you did, and you still see no wrong in to. You compare a poker game to a playgroup? The two aren’t even remotely close!A retraction and public apology are in order.
>W, you seriously need to get a grip. I’ve more than let you have your say. You’re done here. Oh, and you’re still not invited to my playgroup. Neener, neener, neener.