BlogHer Part I: Penelope Trunk Rips Me a New One, Edited with P’s Response!
*Edited to add that Penelope apologized in the comments. Thank you, Penelope. Maybe next year, we can hug it out.
It was my very first BlogHer session and I was all eager and attentive-like. I had my (free) notebook and my (free) pen ready to write down the many nuggets of wisdom I’d surely glean from the carefully chosen speakers assembled to discuss the topic of self branding and promotion. One of those speakers was Penelope Trunk. I had never heard of Penelope Trunk, but she’s apparently some kind of Internet superstar and so, despite the fact that her name made me suspect that she was actually a former castmember from Krofft Superstars, I decided to give her a chance.
After the speakers introduced themselves, the rest of the session was opened to questions from the audience. Penelope, I’m guessing, had accidentally super-glued her hand to the microphone, because she appeared to be unable to hand it to her fellow panelists. And boy! Was she helpful!
Much of the session went this way: audience member asks Penelope a question. Penelope shoots audience member down with barbed one-liner like, “You can’t write about politics and knitting,” delivered in a withering tone.
Mkay.
This would all have been slightly more tolerable if the information were accurate- but much of it seemed just plain wrong, like when a mommyblogger was told that she’d have to write about just one subject, like diapers, to be really successful. Think about the most “successful” mommybloggers for a minute. Most of them will write about just about anything if the mood strikes them. We read them for their voice, not their specific subject matter. Gah!
Much eye-rolling and whispering in the audience ensued. And then a woman named Jen Lemen asked a question. When I heard her say her name, I craned my head to see her. I had read glowing references to Jen on the Internet for years and was totally impressed by her eloquence.
Penelope wasn’t. Penelope shot her down. I gasped.
“You don’t shoot down Jen Lemen,” I whispered to Busy Mom beside me. She shook her head and grimaced.
Of course, this wouldn’t be Suburban Turmoil if I hadn’t been possessed by some kind of malicious spirit that jerked my hand up in the air when the audience microphone was headed my way. In retrospect, it was incredibly stupid of me to ask a question in that kind of environment, but what can I say?
I stood up, introduced myself, and said that while much of the discussion had centered around increasing Internet traffic, I figured that some of us in the room were happy with our blog traffic and wanted to know the next step in taking our blog beyond the Internet, whether we wanted to score a book deal or write a sitcom based on our blog or whatever.
“You can’t get a book deal from a blog,” Penelope said to me with obvious disgust.
From the back of the room, the marvelous Susie Sunshine shouted “Jen Lancaster!” Good one, Susie!
Yes, we all know Penelope’s answer was totally wrong, but the book deal wasn’t even the point of my question. I tried to reword it for her, saying I was only using a book deal as an example. What I really wanted to know was how a blogger could take his or her success beyond the Internet. What was the logical next step? Penelope (who, incidentally, got a book deal from her blog) had no answer for me. Effectively, she only wanted to rip me a new one, just like everyone else. Damn, P-Nel. Bitter much?
I sat down, feeling defeated. Was I really the bumbling idiot that her response had suggested? I had learned one thing from the experience- It would be a cold day in hell before I asked a question in a session again.
Fortunately, my raw deal got a little better when another woman raised her hand and informed Mrs. Trunk that she worked at HarperCollins, where plenty of bloggers had scored book deals. HA!
And when the session ended, a woman behind me tapped me on the shoulder and said she had gotten a book deal from her website just last week.
And literally dozens of people from that session (and plenty of others who had just heard about it) came to me afterward and ranted about Penelope’s hostility. Others wrote about it from their perspective. As far as I know, this particular session was the most contentious one of the whole conference. Gee, I really know how to pick ’em, huh?
Luckily, things took a turn for the better the next morning, when I attended a session on how other bloggers have used their Internet writing to publish books. That session was so helpful that I ended up writing out a blueprint of what I want to do next (which, incidentally, is not necessarily a book deal at all). So no worries, BlogHer people. I totally got my money’s worth.
Don’t worry… The BlogHer stories all get much, much funnier after this one, so stay tuned.
>It sounds to me like she gave the ultimate example-lesson on how to increase traffic and promote yourself – go into a room a piss of a bunch of bloggers. Guaranteed topic and discussion.You linked to her and wrote one of your longer entries in a while about nothing but her.Machiavellian promotion at it’s best.
>What a bitch. I do not care for Penelope. She wrote a ridiculous article today on tips for a career woman that is laughable.We need pics Lindsay!!!
>You pretty much confirmed what I’ve been thinking about Penelope Trunk. Glad I won’t be wasting any of my time reading her stuff.
>OMG…I never heard of that Penelope person until this morning. She was a link on the yahoo.com front page. Her story was “New Workplace Etiquette”..and I was shaking my head thinking if I did ANY of her suggestions I’d be collecting unemployement right now. I think she just makes shit up. I wanna go play with the girls at blogher next year…were there any “half assed blogers?”..or was everyone pretty into it w/ huge blogrolls and …regular readers :-)???
>I couldn’t believe it either. I thought your question was great. Completely spot on. And you totally stood your ground. I love that.And MP, her story was on workplace etiquette? I’m cracking up. What about session moderator etiquette!
>Still bugged I missed that one. I mean I would have loved to have just taken photos of the “WTF” looks on the faces of the attendees. FYI the amazing woman who from Harper Collins is Felicia Sullivan. (Known her for ages. Love her!)I cannot believe there was such cheesy controversy and I missed it.
>Wow, I thought I was the only one rolling my eyes in disbelief at her rudeness and smugness — but I was sitting on the floor, so I couldn’t see anyone else. Her whole demeanor was so “don’t you know who I AM?” Um, sorry, love. Not really. (PS — hi! We sat next to each other briefly on the bed at Y’s infamous gathering. We talked about breast pumps.)
>I just recently discovered your blog. Hi!I wonder if that was her tactic to increase her own site traffic. But really, why would one choose rudness and be so blatantly negative? Makes me shake my head, especially when I come from the belief that anything is possible if you put your mind to it.
>Haven’t you already used your blog to move to the next level? As I understood it the blog helped you get your column at the Scene.
>Eh, she gets so much traffic already that I really don’t care if she gets more from me. Maybe she’ll see it and realize she messed with the wrong dumb blogger…I’m putting pictures up on Flickr today as soon as I get around to it. Some perv added me as a contact, though and I’ve made all my pictures private because of it- Does anyone know how to delete a contact on Flickr?
>I agree that she seemed very dismissive of people’s questions. I’d never heard of her before that session, but she’ll be getting no linky love from me.Great to meet you, Lindsay!
>I’m bummed I missed all this drama. I left the seession midway after an elderly newbie blogger was told not to blog anymore since she wasn’t commenting enough. Sheesh. I’m so glad to have met you too and played a small part in the protection and preservation of your glorious boobs. (Now I’m waiting for the Real Simple party post.)
>Yeah, Penelope is very strong in her convictions.It was so great to mee you!
>The perv on flickr wouldn’t happen to be “addicted2bigtits” would it be?Because that asshole just added me.And how come I missed that panel? Was it at the same time as MY panel? And if so, that’s what you get for NOT SUPPORTING ME.haha.
>In answer to your question, w, yes I got my Scene column from my blog posts, but I’m not paying the mortgage with the money I make off of that (although it certainly helps). I would like to be make enough money so that we could afford a car for my 16-year-old, for example, or go on a family vacation to Italy. Therefore I’m always (and aren’t most of us?) trying to figure out ways to make more money… Thinking of ways to use this blog to help me get there seems like a pretty good idea to me.
>I’ve never heard of her! Bet she won’t be called back, huh? What was she thinking of??
>I’d never heard of Ms. Trunk before this morning… but I saw a link to her article featured on Yahoo! today about the ‘new workplace etiquette’ — and when I read the article I was confused: As your commenters diva and mp mentioned, these looked like tips on how to get fired.I do hope that the rest of your trip to Chicago was more enjoyable… and that you’ll talk about that, too. (We need the tourist money!)
>P.S. — her 10th rule made sense, though: “Be nice like your job depends on it.” Doesn’t sound like she followed her own advice, though, does it?
>Yeah, maybe next year she can go head to head with “Blogging to Books”. Talk about blatant contradictions… I was proud of you for getting all journalistic on her ass. You have no reason to be embarrassed.
>I hear a lot of complaints about that session too. And you know? If I could only right about one very specific niche of motherhood, I wouldn’t bother. (And um, diapers only last two years or so, so then what?) She sounds like an utter bitch. On a happier note – thanks for coming over and saying hi. It was great to meet you, and you are just as lovely in person. and especially, I want to thank you for filming one of our “Hot and Bothered” spots for MBT. I’ll let you know in comments when they’re up, which will hopefully be soon!
>What no throwdown!?That would have made for an even better story 🙂
>just so you know, your Jen Lemen comment during the session made Jen’s day.
>So, I am a career counselor and I can tell you that her workplace etiquette advice is nonsense – plain and simple.Your blog, on the other hand, is perfect each and every time!
>She sounds so arrogant. I write about whatever I feel like because it’s MY blog, dammit!
>Maybe you should not take it so personal. I have heard other bloghers say it was uplifting and directional. If you took it as a personal jab you should have thought of the guests at large not only yourself as this was a conference not a personal one on one.
>Oh, I didn’t take it as a personal jab. I took it as more of a full-on roomwide “fuck you.”
>Sounds like she’s was talking mostly about marketing through search engines as opposed to word of mouth. Both approaches can work… … But I suspect the one that works best for any given writer depends on whether her or she writes mostly for the sheer love of writing vs. mostly for a paycheque. (Not to slam either — god knows, I’ve done both.) p.s. Is her name really Penelope Trunk? She sounds like a Harry Potter character!
>Hi, Lindsay. I’m sorry that I offended so many people that day. I realized that I didn’t say much about the blog to book topic except that I think in most cases the opportunities for blog to book deals are so bad that they may as well not exist. So here is some more information on that. It is true that lots of people get book deals from their blogs. I got two. Darren Rowse asked me to blog about it on Problogger. Here is the link for the post I wrote on how to use your blog to get a book deal:http://www.problogger.net/archives/2007/06/14/how-to-get-a-six-figure-book-deal-from-your-blog/When you think about getting a book deal, you should be really clear on your goals. If you get a deal for a paperback original – which I think is the case with a lot of bloggers — then you probably are getting a mid-five figure advance. If you add up all the time it takes to sell a book, write a book and then publicize it, this is not actually very good money compared to other professional writing opportunities out there. So I think we each need to have a particular goal in publishing a book that is not about the money. Penelope
>I was sitting at the other end of your row during that session… I loved that you held your ground, and I also deeply enjoyed some of your facial expressions during the interchange as you were smacked down for asking what the rest of us really want to know. I think you’ve perfected the wide-eyed ARE YOU FREAKING KIDDING ME?! look!
>I thought that session was completely self serving -the moderators were arrogant and you didn’t deserve the answer you got. My side of the room (I was sitting with Susie) was outraged.
>Hi Lindsay,Like my friend – Absolutely Bananas – I was sitting quite close (directly in front of you and, when turning to quickly, nearly broke my neck, actually) and shamelessly enjoyed your facial expressions!It takes a lot of guts to stand up in front of a speaker, like Ms. Trunk – trust me, I know and nearly fainted in front of the momosphere – but, I did imagine her as a confident speaker, and blogger.The whole reason I decided to attend this session, in the first place.Sadly, I did leave this session feeling she was curt and dismissive with her responses.You, not so much ;o)
>Hey, there. It was great to meet you (our babies were in daycare together). My biggest problem with that panel, beside the alienating tone of Penelope, was that it wasn’t actually about branding–which is a process–nor promotions, either. And really, the two disciplines are so different that they shouldn’t be in the same discussion, as was evidenced by the panelists who had no synchronization. I think the whole session was doomed before it started. I’m working on a submission for next year already. I’ll hit you up for feedback.
>Bossy was sitting next to you during this godless session (because when not saving bloggers and their offspring on shuttle buses, Bossy often attends educational seminars)… Anywho, nice chuckling and guffawing with you for that hour. And eye-rolling, we had plenty of that going on too.
>Penelope,As someone who was excited to see you at the panel and has enjoyed your success online & off, with all do respect, I have to politely disagree with your comments on the panel and the one you’ve posted here.I work in publishing. Many of my friends are aquiring editors, publishing executives, etc, so I’m going to be bold here and relay that I know of what I speak. I am also one of the people who decides on what we should acquire. First off, many, many, many bloggers get book deals. A few years ago publishers went stir crazy and started snapping up books like mad, not thinking about their P&Ls or the fact that the book was a photocopy of the blog. Now, publishers (for the most part) are being more cautious and strategic. From respected finance bloggers to gossip bloggers, they are getting deals. And we’re also discounting the fact that many bloggers, like myself, were authors or had considered writing books before they had a blog. The blog is irrelevant. If anything, it’s the beginning of the platform. What is relevant is the quality of the proposal, it’s uniqueness (an idea that is marketable) and the positioning of the idea/book to the marketplace.What’s relevant is an editor who can sell a writer’s idea to a team of marketing/sales execs who know the marketplace and have seen it all before.As a literary writer who received a modest five-figure advance for her book, I don’t see this as a waste, I see this as a sound investment. I want the ability to earn out my advance so that I could actually have a decent sales track and a writing career. And I can rattle off many, many authors (bloggers and otherwise) who have modest book deals while balancing their day jobs (myself included) and how that’s launched them to more substantial advances because they’ve either acquired great reviews or they have a great sell-through rate.Additionally, no one goes into publishing to make money. If I want that, I’d return to M&A. I think the idea here is to write about something of which you’re passionate and finding the right hook that’ll garner it attention in the marketplace. I would encourage anyone who’s thinking of writing a book to do the research and to write what you’re passionate about. Find an agent who sees your vision and take it from there. Your blog is not a negative. You have readership & an encouraging group of readers who want you to succeed.Cheers, Feliciahttp://www.feliciasullivan.com
>I, too, am sorry I missed this session. It sounded like a riot. I completely understand your question and am wondering much the same thing myself. Hey, if you find the answer, let me know, okay?! I’ll do the same.It was so great to meet you! You are one hot mommy blogger not to mention nice. And talented to boot!
>Go, Felicia!
>I totally missed this session, but your recap covers it well. Oh how I would have loved to be there to egg this woman on.
>I found you through Lena today! I have never heard of Penelope Trunk before. Just who does she think she IS anyway? I enjoyed reading your description of her bad behavior. Good for you for being brave enough to ask a question! Oh and I totally loved your post about the chaos in your house when you returned….
>And BTW, what was the answer to the increasing blog traffic question?
>Yeah, this one is spreading around everywhere… I was having a hard time not standing up and setting the record straight on several points, but had to burst in and say they were full of shit when they said you can’t make money blogging. WTF?! 25% of the conference sessions were dedicated to the business of blogging! And that’s practically all I write about!!Glad to see what you wrote – if you ever have more questions about that subject by all means drop me a line – I think you spoke quite intelligently. 🙂
>Um, WHO?Exactly.
>For the 100th time:Man, I wish I could have gone to BlogHer!
>I heard so many people who came out of this session sad and discouraged because they couldn’t sum up their blog in 5 words or less (Can DOOCE sum up her blog in 5 words or less? And isn’t she kinda successful?).Sad and discouraged seems to be the antithesis of what these sessions should be about.
>Good for you! I occasionally read Penelope Trunk’s Yahoo column just because I know it will make me crazy. I have to go to this conference next year if it means that I’ll get to meet people like you.
>Hi S.T.Thanks for your honest review of that session. I attended BlogHer and was in the room for Penelope’s talk– this was my first BlogHer and first session bare in mind– and was literally stunned by her demeanor. I wanted to ask a question or politely point out that her comments were entirely discouraging and even rude but didn’t have the guts too. Thanks for putting the words up for all of us.
>I heard quite a few folks that thought this session was a little mean. Like WTF are you doing at a Blog convention if you are gonna slame blogs?
>Suburban Turmoil said… Oh, I didn’t take it as a personal jab. I took it as more of a full-on roomwide “fuck you.”I haven’t stopped laughing since I read this. Lindsay, you totally rock! I’m so glad I got to meet you!Still. laughing.Shash
>I’m not a big blogger – mostly do it for family, actually – so, sadly, I’ll never end up at a beautiful paradise known as BlogHer. However, what it sounds like (both in what you wrote and P’s response) is that she doesn’t want anyone with whom she must compete. Her approach seems very much “I’M the queen bee here and you all should bow before me and anything that dribbles from your mouth can’t be worth what I mutter in my sleep.”
>Wow! I actually starting blogging in big part because of reading Penelope’s posts almost everyday… it blew me away to hear that she had been so rude. I’m sorry for that! I’m glad that you’re a success on your own and dont appear to be the type of person to take “blog-bitching” to heart. Kudos to your blog… and to bravely asking a question!
>You pretty much confirmed what I’ve been thinking about Penelope Trunk.
>You will totally score a book deal and your book will be fantastic. I still think about that baptism scene you wrote about a long while back. I’m predicting many mega-hit books for you!
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I don’t understand why PT’s so popular. She seems like a narcissist bitch that gets away with everything because she calls it Asperger
[…] Extreem open. Heeft ze borderline? Is ze een narcist? Asperger’s, zegt ze zelf. Of is ze gewoon een bitch? Van alles wat […]
I once had a misfortune of coming across PT’s blog while perusing career advice on the Internet. I admit, she is very intriguing in the way a trainwreck would be. Penelope Trunk has led a bad life – which is not her fault – but the unfortunate result of this is that she is bitter and likes to project her negativity on other people. Most of her “advice” is just limiting “don’t do this, don’t do that, don’t do this unless…ONLY do that” negativity meant to provoke people’s (especially women’s) insecurities. It’s all “don’t go to grad school, don’t do start-ups in Silicon…don’t move to New York!” Her perfect world seems to be one in which women other than her don’t succeed or are happy.
I once had a misfortune of coming across PT’s blog while perusing career advice on the Internet. I admit, she is very intriguing in the way a trainwreck would be. Penelope Trunk has led a bad life – which is not her fault – but the unfortunate result of this is that she is bitter and likes to project her negativity on other people. Most of her “advice” is just limiting “don’t do this, don’t do that, don’t do this unless…ONLY do that” negativity meant to provoke people’s (especially women’s) insecurities. It’s all “don’t go to grad school, don’t do start-ups in Silicon…don’t move to New York!” Her perfect world seems to be one in which women other than her don’t succeed or are happy.